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#16October 1st, 2006 · 04:48 AM
118 threads / 55 songs
3,086 posts
Netherlands
BasketCase wrote…
mud wrote…
I can get rid of the songs with less than 15 votes from the battles. I just figured it would still be possible to get rid of them, but once they are deleted from the battle no way to get them back. So, if you guys still think we should have 20 votes minimum, we can do that. Or, if you want to do 15, we can do that.

I made the music page so when you are logged in as the user, the stars dont appear. They only show up to everyone else. They seem kinda like an annoying thing to get in the way when you have the form there as Puppet pointed out.

About the voting.. I could put an additional vote box (exactly like the one we had before) with 10 ratings. Perhaps this would be better?


Well Mud me personally I don't think you should be able to give a vote under 50% so what if there was 6 stars...the first being 50% then up by 10% for each star? This would eliminate sabotage votes and personally Ive only heard one song on this site that wasn't at least mediocre. I never understood why the voting started at 10% Just my thoughts.......How bad would a piece of someones creativity and emotions have to be to receive 10%?  I just don't think its possible.......and useless to have the voting start so low, all it does is enable the few bad apples to mess with the rankings and battle outcomes.

That's a very interesting thought. ofcourse bad apples don't stand a chance on this site, now that we have TWO active moderators keeping track of just about everything that's going on over here (me & JimkDaAdtman) but I get what you are saying. However my main concern is the visibility of the stars and whether people know what to do with them. They're on top of every forum thread and even here over my text edit box as I'm writing this. It seems a useful way of getting some feedback for the threads you've started, but songs that you put in a battle are a different thing... I vote for the 10% step increment system like we had before - maybe in a new shape? I don't even think that's necessary. The idea of votes below 50% being only there for vengeance and sabotage - that IS really interesting. Having it impossible to vote below 50% will surely get rid of this malicious behaviour - but we need to vote about that to see if people agree with it
#17October 1st, 2006 · 06:22 AM
15 threads / 14 songs
140 posts
United Kingdom
Well, I'd agree with all that. I can't remember voting below 50% but I'm not too keen on the 5 star system. If, however the 5 stars represented 60%, 70%, 80%, 90%, 100% then that'd be cool for me, but it'd need to be clearly represented as such I think and it needs to be far more 'in your face' to combat the problem we already have with low vote counts. My thought about the 5 tier voting system(at 20% intervals) is that, with so few votes being cast, it becomes ever more difficult to rank one song differently from another- ie you'll have so many songs with the same rating at the end of the battle; how do you decide on 1st, 2nd, 3rd when they all have 85%?

 However, having said all that, I think it should be a different system for votes to songs than for ratings for threads etc. (Do we need a feature for rating threads at all? IMO, no, but that's just my opinion.)

As to malicious behaviour/ sabotage, does that really happen?! If it does then perhaps the only way to stop it would be for ratings to be visible to one and all or at least to the person whose song is voted on. That way there would be no hiding from the 'opinions' you're throwing about. It's easy to click 10% when no-one will ever know but if you know it's going to be seen, at least by the person whose song it is, I think it would be a little harder to do.

EDIT A couple of other little things I've noticed- On my home page, I have some of my songs listed there. Next to them is a little box which I think is supposed to represent the vote count on the song (A number above a star) This, for my songs at least, is actually the correct figure for number of critiques and not votes. The number of critiques is also listed in brackets underneath which I assume is where it's supposed to be.
Also, what are the little + and - boxes for that are on the browsing pages (eg October battle)?
#18October 1st, 2006 · 07:48 AM
118 threads / 55 songs
3,086 posts
Netherlands
the + and - boxes are to expand/collapse additional text boxes, just like the way quotes work.

malicious behaviour / sabotage DOES happen, albeit sparsely. And we - the moderators - warn those who do it, and if they do not correct themselves, they can leave the site permanently... if you know what I mean. just keeping a nice balance.

The blog is working fine now - but I've had some problems uploading a new picture. Apparently the use of comma's and apostrophes and other special characters seem to make it not work. Writing a description without the use of those character made it work though...
#19October 1st, 2006 · 08:01 AM
118 threads / 55 songs
3,086 posts
Netherlands
hmm, it seems the most recent mp3 uploads aren't playing in the amp... (or showing up in the audio review forum). I guess there's an important bug there!
#20October 1st, 2006 · 12:32 PM
34 threads / 16 songs
538 posts
Mexico
Well, this may be another IE bug, but...
The "new mp3", "new posts" etc menu is below everything else in the front page.
Is it suposed to be that way or it should be next to the rest?

EDIT: Puppet's right the latest mp3 won't play!
#21October 1st, 2006 · 12:49 PM
31 threads / 19 songs
612 posts
Canada
PuppetXeno wrote…
BasketCase wrote…
mud wrote…
I can get rid of the songs with less than 15 votes from the battles. I just figured it would still be possible to get rid of them, but once they are deleted from the battle no way to get them back. So, if you guys still think we should have 20 votes minimum, we can do that. Or, if you want to do 15, we can do that.

I made the music page so when you are logged in as the user, the stars dont appear. They only show up to everyone else. They seem kinda like an annoying thing to get in the way when you have the form there as Puppet pointed out.

About the voting.. I could put an additional vote box (exactly like the one we had before) with 10 ratings. Perhaps this would be better?


Well Mud me personally I don't think you should be able to give a vote under 50% so what if there was 6 stars...the first being 50% then up by 10% for each star? This would eliminate sabotage votes and personally Ive only heard one song on this site that wasn't at least mediocre. I never understood why the voting started at 10% Just my thoughts.......How bad would a piece of someones creativity and emotions have to be to receive 10%?  I just don't think its possible.......and useless to have the voting start so low, all it does is enable the few bad apples to mess with the rankings and battle outcomes.

That's a very interesting thought. ofcourse bad apples don't stand a chance on this site, now that we have TWO active moderators keeping track of just about everything that's going on over here (me & JimkDaAdtman) but I get what you are saying. However my main concern is the visibility of the stars and whether people know what to do with them. They're on top of every forum thread and even here over my text edit box as I'm writing this. It seems a useful way of getting some feedback for the threads you've started, but songs that you put in a battle are a different thing... I vote for the 10% step increment system like we had before - maybe in a new shape? I don't even think that's necessary. The idea of votes below 50% being only there for vengeance and sabotage - that IS really interesting. Having it impossible to vote below 50% will surely get rid of this malicious behaviour - but we need to vote about that to see if people agree with it ;)


Well Puppet I'm not a fan of the stars either I just thought it was the new system so used it in my suggestion.I think however the old drop down window is much more convenient and isn't going to be missed as easily as the stars tucked away in the corner. I still think the voting should start at 50%, for reasons I stated before but also so when new members upload their work their not discouraged and leave. It seems lately we've been getting some young members just starting to explore their  creative sides and I think it would be a shame if they were discouraged from a site that is supposed to help them further their studies of music. Yes the two mods will help(congrats JimK) But why not make your jobs easier and stop it from even happening? You 2 will have alot more important things to do than watchin out for the few people we are talking about.So in closing I would like to know who has to vote on it?

                      BasketCase, Jay
#22October 1st, 2006 · 05:29 PM
74 threads / 5 songs
441 posts
United States of America
Ok. A bunch of updates.

Fixed the display issues in IE (for the most part). I will perhaps get it done professionally in the near future for maximum compatability. I would suggest people use Firefox or Opera, however.

You should be able to upload MP3's now... There was a problem with the paths. Just one of those moving from dev->current bugs that happen. Sorry, I should have tested earlier, but slipped my mind. I suggest you delete the ones that do not work, if you have one, and re-upload.
#23October 1st, 2006 · 05:31 PM
74 threads / 5 songs
441 posts
United States of America
As far as the stars. How about this: The stars could count the relative distance of wherever you clicked in the stars. So, you could click 25% of the way through the 3rd star, and that would be a vote of 3.25 stars... or 65%. This would actually give you more possibilities than before... Yet, would be easier to use.

BTW, do we have a Guide to Critiquing on bandamp? That would be really great for the about page!
#24October 1st, 2006 · 06:15 PM
74 threads / 5 songs
441 posts
United States of America
Is song posting working for anyone?
#25October 1st, 2006 · 06:24 PM
34 threads / 16 songs
538 posts
Mexico
IE issues remain the same... but I'm getting Firefox, so you can see how much I like this site 
#26October 1st, 2006 · 06:31 PM
74 threads / 5 songs
441 posts
United States of America
lol, ok, thanks

it works somewhat in ie now. At least you can see everything on my version.
#27October 1st, 2006 · 06:48 PM
34 threads / 16 songs
538 posts
Mexico
yea I can see everything but it's all messed up.  For example the "+", "-" little boxes that (I imagine) should be next to the menus they open/close are in my version way below.  The  bandamp logo with the "Wellcome..." thing sometimes appears on top but sometimes on bottom of the screen. On the chat, the "users online" box moves from top to bottom, etc 

So I guess I'm getting firefox 
#28October 1st, 2006 · 09:56 PM
66 threads / 55 songs
697 posts
United States of America
er... Iszil can't log in. Not sure what the problem is. But he's pretty upset. He gets this:

Warning: session_start() [function.session-start]: The session id contains illegal characters, valid characters are a-z, A-Z, 0-9 and '-,' in /web/bandamp.com/z_func.php on line 10

btw, he's using firefox.
#29October 1st, 2006 · 09:57 PM
117 threads / 55 songs
1,540 posts
Chile
Well, now works with MI Explorer, but I can't do it with FF.
Mud, I need your help.

      > Iszil
#30October 1st, 2006 · 09:59 PM
66 threads / 55 songs
697 posts
United States of America
oh, and just for in your spare time, some bugs that I've noticed:

1. the "you've got mail" icon is always there
2. I have the ability to rate threads outside of the audio review, this one for example...
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