| From one Living Miracle.. |
I have said numerous times that if I ever publish
my complete views and beliefs on this subject, then
alot of people will gather together and nail my ass
to a very large two piece wooden Phallus Symbol....
I will say that I have lived long enough to witness
three very real miracles, in which one I am a living
example of... just think of what all I went through
in less then a ten month time span.. every doctor
and specialist has all said I should have died... well
that's just one example of the three I refer... I
don't buy organized religions and CON's.. the
Guilt Trip Salvation is FUCKED UP!! but there
is something that should have all skeptics take a
good long look at! That is three very real miracles
including my own life!
Blessings,
Bluey
my complete views and beliefs on this subject, then
alot of people will gather together and nail my ass
to a very large two piece wooden Phallus Symbol....
I will say that I have lived long enough to witness
three very real miracles, in which one I am a living
example of... just think of what all I went through
in less then a ten month time span.. every doctor
and specialist has all said I should have died... well
that's just one example of the three I refer... I
don't buy organized religions and CON's.. the
Guilt Trip Salvation is FUCKED UP!! but there
is something that should have all skeptics take a
good long look at! That is three very real miracles
including my own life!
Blessings,
Bluey
| hey |
No it's the same direction, consider my post a billboard on the highway of philosophy.. I just wanted to toss a bit of meandering info up there, to help fuel some more conversation.I wasn't actually refuting anything you said, nor even really even agreeing, I was more just tossing a couple more logs on the fire... I think as long as we can keep this civil, and intelligent, we can have one heck of a discussion on this. This is the topic though, as point ed out to me by another member, that can fuel some serious crap posts, and hate messages... And I want to make it clear that that will not be tolerated, I don't want to censor anything, but I will not tolerate disregard for a persons feelings. If we are to truly co-exist, we must do so with love and compassion. And one thing this community has alot of, it's love and compassion. Bandamp is the greatest tribute to humanity the WWW has ever seen. And I believe that we can all be grown up and caring enough, to carry on a wonderful dialog... 
I hope you all agree...
JimK
I hope you all agree...
JimK
| re: hey |
JimkDaAdtman wrote…
No it's the same direction, consider my post a billboard on the highway of philosophy.. I just wanted to toss a bit of meandering info up there, to help fuel some more conversation.I wasn't actually refuting anything you said, nor even really even agreeing, I was more just tossing a couple more logs on the fire... I think as long as we can keep this civil, and intelligent, we can have one heck of a discussion on this. This is the topic though, as point ed out to me by another member, that can fuel some serious crap posts, and hate messages... And I want to make it clear that that will not be tolerated, I don't want to censor anything, but I will not tolerate disregard for a persons feelings. If we are to truly co-exist, we must do so with love and compassion. And one thing this community has alot of, it's love and compassion. Bandamp is the greatest tribute to humanity the WWW has ever seen. And I believe that we can all be grown up and caring enough, to carry on a wonderful dialog...
I hope you all agree...
JimK
Well said. As someone who has started these types of discussions on many other forums and felt the "administration", I appreciate your open-ness.
Each one to its own guys!!!
As far as heated debates and flaming war ,Ill make sure I pass that down to my brother in law who was shot down in Iraq and killed leaving 2 children and a wife. Oh and I tell my sister in law don't worry there's no God but it will be OK there's science!!!!!
Faith is matter of choice so why tamper with others if have the rights to your own!!
As far as heated debates and flaming war ,Ill make sure I pass that down to my brother in law who was shot down in Iraq and killed leaving 2 children and a wife. Oh and I tell my sister in law don't worry there's no God but it will be OK there's science!!!!!
Faith is matter of choice so why tamper with others if have the rights to your own!!
I wrote something genius but the logout expired (in 15 minutes)
So it was lost in cyberspace. God must not like me
Anyway to say it again, but put in less mild words:
In history religion has been used as a tool to suppress the masses. Imprinting shame and guilt and linking this to a higher being which must be appeased at all cost, also linking very generic things such as love and humanity to something outside - external, thus out of an individual's control - is a very common way to do this.
How people can worship humanity in the image of a bleeding, suffering man on a torture device goes beyond my understanding.
Science vs God is something you shouldn't go into. Stephen Hawking is a very spiritual person. He questions the creation story as written in the bible, but at the same time questions how one can NOT believe in (a) God seing how wonderfully complex and perfect existance in itself is.
To me, the universe is One Being. All it's systemics, from the meta- to the quantumphysical are it's organs and it's veins, and as it contains Life - and life can only exist under the perfect conditions that were created as a result of these systemics - one can conclude that life is inherent to the universe, and thus must be part of it's perfect functioning.
The fact that the question of "purpose" cannot be anwered must either mean that the question itself is irrelevant, or that it is just a device to keep the brain stirring, like a metaphysical drug, to keep you alert and awake and moving forward through life. Seems fine by me. It sure beats the hell out of cafeine, which I avoid at all times.
Cheers,
Tom
So it was lost in cyberspace. God must not like me
Anyway to say it again, but put in less mild words:
In history religion has been used as a tool to suppress the masses. Imprinting shame and guilt and linking this to a higher being which must be appeased at all cost, also linking very generic things such as love and humanity to something outside - external, thus out of an individual's control - is a very common way to do this.
How people can worship humanity in the image of a bleeding, suffering man on a torture device goes beyond my understanding.
Science vs God is something you shouldn't go into. Stephen Hawking is a very spiritual person. He questions the creation story as written in the bible, but at the same time questions how one can NOT believe in (a) God seing how wonderfully complex and perfect existance in itself is.
To me, the universe is One Being. All it's systemics, from the meta- to the quantumphysical are it's organs and it's veins, and as it contains Life - and life can only exist under the perfect conditions that were created as a result of these systemics - one can conclude that life is inherent to the universe, and thus must be part of it's perfect functioning.
The fact that the question of "purpose" cannot be anwered must either mean that the question itself is irrelevant, or that it is just a device to keep the brain stirring, like a metaphysical drug, to keep you alert and awake and moving forward through life. Seems fine by me. It sure beats the hell out of cafeine, which I avoid at all times.
Cheers,
Tom
First off, Puppet, you should read "The Last Question" by Isaac Asimov (http://www.multivax.com/last_question.html) if you haven't already. It's a (very) short story, and in my opinion, is one of the greatest pieces of fictional writing in the last century.
I don't agree that life is inherent to the universe--at least not in the way that you believe it. The universe, for all purposes, is infinite. It's isn't a stretch to say because of the billions of different scenarios life is bound to exist. Whether we are the only form of life or not is difficult to say, but I am a strong believer that there is lots of intelligent life out there.
And while there are people worshiping the image of a tortured man, I think they are worshiping the ultimate sacrifice he gave for his cause (my beliefs about what actually happened tell a different story to the Bible) that allowed them to be who they are, rather than the "bleeding, suffering man" that he is.
I don't agree that life is inherent to the universe--at least not in the way that you believe it. The universe, for all purposes, is infinite. It's isn't a stretch to say because of the billions of different scenarios life is bound to exist. Whether we are the only form of life or not is difficult to say, but I am a strong believer that there is lots of intelligent life out there.
And while there are people worshiping the image of a tortured man, I think they are worshiping the ultimate sacrifice he gave for his cause (my beliefs about what actually happened tell a different story to the Bible) that allowed them to be who they are, rather than the "bleeding, suffering man" that he is.
avinashv wrote…
I don't agree that life is inherent to the universe--at least not in the way that you believe it. The universe, for all purposes, is infinite. It's isn't a stretch to say because of the billions of different scenarios life is bound to exist. Whether we are the only form of life or not is difficult to say, but I am a strong believer that there is lots of intelligent life out there.
Well I wasn't stating an opinion, merely an observation. Or do you believe life is a coincidence? There are way too many "coincidences" in the way the laws of physics work together that make life possible. The laws of physics are the way they are, they are inherent to the universe, and life is inherent to the way the laws of physics are. It's by all means built in to the system, and yes you can imagine that there must be hundreds of billions of lifeforms out there. It's not exactly a luck of the draw...
avinashv wrote…
And while there are people worshiping the image of a tortured man, I think they are worshiping the ultimate sacrifice he gave for his cause (my beliefs about what actually happened tell a different story to the Bible) that allowed them to be who they are, rather than the "bleeding, suffering man" that he is.
Well he died a horrible, slow death, and that image, more than anything about his life, is symbol to the religion in question. They also, symbolically, eat his flesh and drink his blood. It's a necromantic blood cult I tell you.
Well I wasn't stating an opinion, merely an observation. Or do you believe life is a coincidence? There are way too many "coincidences" in the way the laws of physics work together that make life possible. The laws of physics are the way they are, they are inherent to the universe, and life is inherent to the way the laws of physics are. It's by all means built in to the system, and yes you can imagine that there must be hundreds of billions of lifeforms out there. It's not exactly a luck of the draw...
The word 'coincidence' is stronger than I'd like. Life isn't a coincidence, it is just the correct chain of events which were bound to happen given the almost infinite number of choices in the universe. If that's a coincidence (some may say so), then great.
Well he died a horrible, slow death, and that image, more than anything about his life, is symbol to the religion in question. They also, symbolically, eat his flesh and drink his blood. It's a necromantic blood cult I tell you.
I didn't know about this cannibalism. Fair enough.
Actually, that cannibalsim quote was taken a little out of context, Puppet. Said a friend:
"and the words eat his flesh and drink is blood is used because eating and drinking are things u have to do in order to survive, so in that same breath, take in jesus as a means of survival"
"and the words eat his flesh and drink is blood is used because eating and drinking are things u have to do in order to survive, so in that same breath, take in jesus as a means of survival"
A flippant reply to this could be ... "so who cares?"
Of course, there are truly millions of people who care about their religion with many of them willing to die for their faith. This worries me somewhat because I am cynical in my view of "leaders" and I can't help but think that the whole organised religion thing is just Man's way of trying to control people.
I don't believe in any specific god... I cannot believe in a personal god (that is, someone who watches out for everyone), but we came from somewhere, somehow, and that's enough for me to believe that there is a greater force out there which is beyond Man's understanding.
We are energetic beings... made of energy; as is everything everywhere. We are electrons, neutrons and protons organised into atoms, arranged into molecules, which combined together appears to create it's own energy. When we die, part of that energy leaves the body and goes.....? Well it goes somewhere (assuming that energy can be neither created or destroyed, but changes form).
Do I believe in the "virtues of science"; yes, I do. I also think that there is a place for religion (organised or not), which can be a great comfort to people in many situations. But then these religions should be working together to guide and support everyone - it's disturbing to see wars in the name of religion and altogether wrong in my mind.
Do I ramble on sometimes.... oh yes, oh yes!!!
Of course, there are truly millions of people who care about their religion with many of them willing to die for their faith. This worries me somewhat because I am cynical in my view of "leaders" and I can't help but think that the whole organised religion thing is just Man's way of trying to control people.
I don't believe in any specific god... I cannot believe in a personal god (that is, someone who watches out for everyone), but we came from somewhere, somehow, and that's enough for me to believe that there is a greater force out there which is beyond Man's understanding.
We are energetic beings... made of energy; as is everything everywhere. We are electrons, neutrons and protons organised into atoms, arranged into molecules, which combined together appears to create it's own energy. When we die, part of that energy leaves the body and goes.....? Well it goes somewhere (assuming that energy can be neither created or destroyed, but changes form).
Do I believe in the "virtues of science"; yes, I do. I also think that there is a place for religion (organised or not), which can be a great comfort to people in many situations. But then these religions should be working together to guide and support everyone - it's disturbing to see wars in the name of religion and altogether wrong in my mind.
Do I ramble on sometimes.... oh yes, oh yes!!!
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