What I don't understand about the battle.....
How can it be called a honest battle when songs are submitted that have been recorded ,in some case's years ago..The song has been on the musicians music page collecting votes., then when it has reached a certain amount of votes it is submitted into the battle.already surpassing the required amount of votes to be consided in the battle

Let me put it another way.....How can a horse race be a honest horse race when one horse is 5 feet from the finish line when the race begins.... while the other horses are at the starting gate ?

Idea...you can submit a song with 4 or less votes only

OR

 make up 4 tittles to songs..for the month of that battle..and songs are to be written that month with one of the 4 tittles as the song...this way you have a fair battle and you have a creative idea this way
everyone starts on the same level. and you have to be creative to write/record a song with one of the 4 tittles  in the month of that battle

Flyer

THIS IS A FABULOUS IDEA!!!!

 I love it!!!!

       I think we should try to get this idea implemented!  What a great way to stir creative juices!!

                      JimK

I agree about the part of not being able to submit a song that has been setting around collecting votes going up against newly uploaded songs if the voting is done by the amount of votes and not the  percent of the vote.

  I like the idea for the four song title competition too.... the only thing is some musicians have more time to spend/or are more prolific writers than others.  Nobody writes the same way and some songs take longer than others.  I like the idea of it but I also think that a competition like that should be a separate event.

  I read at one time on the introduction page where it was stated that you could enter your songs now or let them set and collect votes....... because of this I thought the voting was based not on the numbers of votes but the level % of the votes.  You could have  50 votes of 30 %, or  20 votes of  95%, and the 20 vote one would win. That is how I thought it worked but I may be wrong... The Idea is that now that we know the voting works,  we can all start voting on the current battle, and then  all entries will have at least the minimum amount of votes.................. hopefully.

I don't really agree with you man... it ain't about how many votes you get, you know man, it's about how high your voting average is man... it shouldn't make a difference if you wrote a good song and get 20 votes, you will still beat someone who wrote a not as good song with 500 votes. Quality over quantity man...

Also it's not really a disadvantage to anyone... because you too can choose when you want to enter the battle, you can wait a year if you want you know man. I know some people prefer to get there songs critiqued and all as soon as possible that's fine, I, for one, got a song or two just sitting and waiting... this is because i don't want to put it in the battles that have been happening the last few months... the voting is, for the main part, broken man... and so I would rather wait  until the voting gets up to scratch before putting my songs in there.

I dont agree with you at all, Chill Plus your talking about votes. Its not the votes Im refering to. Its about entering a song that is say 2 yrs old..it has 20 votes..you enter a song you just wrote with no votes...Now YOU Tell Me where the Battle is. And your wrong to a point. Yes it does matter how many votes you recieve...If you dont pull in 15 votes you dont qualilfy in the battle...which is the point im making.
Also you say you have a song that you want to enter into the battle but your not because you say the voting system isnt working right..if thats the case,then dont leave it siting with all you other songs  so it can collect the 15 required votes..post it when your ready to enter it,,,simple enough
The point is this.  Every song should start the battle evenly or close to it


Flyer

Thats a good idea about having it as separate battle. Good point also about the free time some musicians have...But I still disagree with the battles rules that you can enter a song that already has at least 15 votes


Flyer

Yes, nice point flyer.
Some songs may have a month, some may have 10. Maybe sort it out for a "battle vote" open for the month, and an "overall vote" which allows them to get a general idea of what people think. Also allows for voting after a battle has finished... But I do agree they shouldn't be  more than, say, 3 months old, maybe more. Because you may have a song you want to post, but have other songs in the current battle, would people post less songs? I think the limited vote entry would work.

Nice idea! I'd love to see it put into action.

WB

Maybe ... The low vote limit for songs to be entered in a battle is a good idea. But then, in combination with an OR function: "song has less than 5(or so) votes OR has been uploaded less than a month ago" can be entered in the next battle. How does that sound?

An advanced songwriters battle (like the 4 title competition) sounds interesting aswell, but would only appeal to a limited number of members. For instance I myself probably won't subscribe to it but I think I'd keep track of the outcome... You know. Maybe do something like that every 3 months, not every month... ?

Btw the voting thing is fixed again but it's always been a problem to actually GET people to vote. Anyway chill is right, it's about the percentage average in the end... Not about the number of votes. And a song that doesn't get the required number of votes - should say something about the song... Right?

What if a song has more then 5 votes but is a month or less old ?
will it be allowed to enter the battle ?
I think thats a good idea to have the advanced songwriters battle every 3 months
You said it yourself Puppet its a problem to get people to vote...not that the song isnt good...most People just dont vote
last month 1 song quailfied for the battle..I doubt if all the other songs were bad and this month is the same thing..one song qualifies
and the song was recorded a yr ago

I think when somone hears a song they should have to place a vote ..if they dont place a vote then they wont be able to hear another song...

So place your vote if you want to listen to another song
also I think guest should be allowed to place a vote....More Guest listen to our Music..then we do
they cant leave a comment..but would be able to vote..If they can hear a song
then why cant they vote ?



Flyer

The reason why guest votes aren't allowed is because of fraud sensitivity. Members with access to multiple computers could vote on their own songs easily without being traced, ... in fact there are occasions of fraud of members making up multiple accounts and vote on their own songs from different computers. Luckily it doesnt happen a lot...

Agreed, to the guests who really do like to vote for real it's kindof sad that they haven't the possibility. The thresh is set as high as them having to open an account and then vote.

As for songs less than a month old but with more than 5 votes, yes I think they should be allowed to enter the battle. Obviously these songs draw some attention, so they should be pretty good ones. The one month margin gives the uploader some time to observe the chances of the song getting a decent rating - I don't see why this is a problem, however I do agree that putting a song in the battle which already HAS a good rating, and was uploaded 2 years ago, that that is unfair. I've done it myself though but the battle system was down at the time, and I knew the IE votes weren't coming through. So it didn't mean a thing anyway.

Lastly I DO agree that we need to implement a feature which makes sure you have to rate a song after you've listened to it. Ofcourse there are members who say "sorry, I won't vote because it's unfinished" but then those kind of songs should go in a seperate forum! I know this seperate unfinished-tracks forum was rejected by the programmer but I didn't get to vote a yes or nay myself on that, so I demand a recount!

I like the idea of the voting thing but I would think the pressure would be better if you stated that you have to vote on at least three songs in the current battle before you can upload any song or new version of old song ect.
every upload would require  3 reviews and 3 votes and hey if the song ain't finished (like some of mine were) they can skip it and go on to one that is. I personally would not enter a unfinished song into battle  so if the voting requirement  was kept to current battle only it would be songs supposedly ready for battle.

I mean the Idea is for us to review and vote both,  give critiques and suggestions to help each other out and advance our skills.  I for one am more interested in informative critiques that help than a winning a battle, but for some I can see that would be important to show creedence to their writing and recording improvements

man this is too long

so  required voting and review for uploads and or listening  is cool with me

Well, I've said this before but here I go again..Personally I don't think it should be "voting"..soon as I here that word I think as it as endorsing something..like this song is worthy of my vote..It should be rating..Every song is worthy of a rating from every member, even if its a low one. Some members get more votes than others regardless of the quality of the song...they "vote" for that user name..(I found also the more your active in the chat and posting you seem to get more votes as well..)Correct me if I'm wrong I thought it was about the music and not the user being nice or an active member of the chat or forums. I have a few ideas myself..

a) only finished projects can be entered
b) either get rid of the minimum amount of "votes"
needed or only allow songs to be entered that aren't
older than 3 months.
c) every user must "vote" on at least 80% of the
battle entries or they will not be able to upload any of their
own music(shouldn't be hard to setup, could be just like 3 post
rule when you sign up)
d) actually get rid of the required amount of votes all together
    and use Zach's formula...

Also I believe after the battle is over the top 10 songs(Zach's formula) should go into their own battle, We have two moderators who know a bit (just kidding) about music and I believe they could have an unbiased opinion and select the top 3.....Almost every battle there are songs that I feel are getting snubbed by not getting enough "votes" or are getting unfair ratings..(or discriminated against because of its genre)I don't think that Ive seen a battle where I could agree with the final outcome, the winner usually and maybe 2nd and 3rd but after that to me its seems as if it the user name had more to do with it than the actual song.

I haven't done much with the whole voting/rating thing since I understood it didn't work. I do read the comments and they usually make a lot of sense! Users know how they can best use!

I simply wanted to tie something in here,
This makes all the sense in the world when a "Collaboration Forum" is added, leaving the "Audio Review" to become a 'Pro Forum', where the finished collabs and the 'serious independent artists' would be posted. And where you could sort out a good voting system. Voting is not needed in a collab forum.

There wasn't much response for the idea of a collab forum in the other posts, but I do see it fitting in with this idea.

I thought of a good alternative: make it mandatory to leave a rating to the song if it's in the battle. That way the audio review can be the lovely chaos it's always been, and when you click a song that's in a battle (perhaps marked with for instance a green star on the side?) you are prompted to leave a rating (which you can naturally change after you've listened to the song). Hows about that? I'm thinking that's coding wise a plausible option?

you could even make it like when your trying to log in if you don't have the user name or password right you cant go in it just keeps goin back to that page ............you click on a song in the battle it tells you,   like with a green star and it prompts you for a review and ratings,  if you don't review or rate the page, will just refresh itself and prompt you again .............he he he

Edit: Then again if more members would click on the browse tab look down the left hand side they would see current battle and next battle selections ........click on those and look for the songs without the yellow stars  those are the songs that haven't been voted on by that person yet.  then if they have the time listen to a few and vote... next time on do the same  It won't take long to get through the whole battle. hey and if you have already given a review but did not vote you can go to your review and hit the little    edit word and  add a vote without having to review again....