#1March 21st, 2008 · 09:02 AM
116 threads / 26 songs
1,361 posts
United States of America
an alternate to deleting songs (& other options)
I realize that we just talked about how certain features shouldn't really be worried about over the more pressing problems, but I wanted to at least make this comment:

I was thinking about how to avoid the whole song deletion controversy :P  What if a member had the option from his/her My Music page to "archive" a song, thus removing it from the Audio review forum's song list (which is likely buried at least in the 2nd or 3rd page).  The user's My Music page would still show it as uploaded, although archived.  Clicking on the song from the My Music page would be the only way to have access the thread.  The mp3 part of the user's post would then be omitted (commented out of the php code or something) and and all of the posts would be viewable.  Posting would be locked on the topic (again, just comment out the "post a reply" part of the page's php html-building script).

We circumvent the problem of deleting people's remarks (as was complained about a while back) and at the same time shoot down the mp3 file so that it can't be listened to anymore (since that's likely the goal the user had in mind). 

Extra optional tailoring:
-add a "unarchive" feature, to bring the song back out into the open.
-altering the "song's uploaded" stat by each users name to only reflect the number of unarchived songs.

conceptually, are there any opinions about that?  this certainly would be something taken care of later, as there are more important issues to be dealt with first, I think.
#2March 21st, 2008 · 12:17 PM
115 threads / 52 songs
3,046 posts
Netherlands
Sounds good to me, I am all for this feature. Albeit I do not consider this a pressing matter, but giving members more control over their material on here is a good thing IMO.

Song options could maybe be set from one's music page via tags:

Song is listed in Audio Review [yes/no] (or (eventually?)...listed in [Audio Review/Work in Progress Pit*])
Song is Playable [yes/no]
#3March 21st, 2008 · 12:53 PM
116 threads / 26 songs
1,361 posts
United States of America
mmm, i agree.  I like the idea of (eventually) adding a Work-In-Progress pit.
#4March 22nd, 2008 · 07:53 AM
115 threads / 52 songs
3,046 posts
Netherlands
.......craaaapppp

I wrote a much larger post than what ended up on here, but somehow my browser started to have issues and there was NO WAY I could get back onto bandamp to fix the bad result of this half-post.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>IT STILL TAKES WAAAYY TOOO LOOOONGG TO LOAD A SINGLE PAGE ON THIS FORUM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1111111111111                                                              *

Anyway I'll try again. I have a slight hangover so it's not going to be the longish post I wrote last night... I'll cut it down to the essence.


I WOULD LIKE TO SEE more control to one's uploaded work! It would be very cool to be able to set options for songs (and per song) on one's music page. Options could include:

Song is listed in [Audio Review/Work in Progress Pit/Archived(not listed)]
Song is Playable [yes/no] if tagged no, rating and commenting should be disabled aswell, and all the conditions of the latter option should be met and respected aswell.
Song is Downloadable [yes/no]
Song Thread accepts comments [yes/no] if tagged no, rating is disabled aswell, and song cannot be entered in a battle. Cannot be tagged no if song is already in a battle.

Tags can be changed at any point a member chooses to.

How about a Audio Review sub-forum listing only songs that are in a battle? I know the Current Battle page, but I'm talking specific forum layout for those songs. Right on top of the Audio Review forum could be a link to the Battle Review forum.

Anyway these were ideas that have been playing in my mind for quite a while, and this is certainly meeting TLS's idea from the start of this thread. I hope posting this post will cause no problems this time!






* yes I know what this looks like, and it looks like that on purpose :razz:
#5March 22nd, 2008 · 08:16 AM
115 threads / 52 songs
3,046 posts
Netherlands
ps emoticon does not show up
#6March 22nd, 2008 · 11:15 AM
31 threads / 19 songs
612 posts
Canada
PuppetXeno wrote…
.......craaaapppp

I wrote a much larger post than what ended up on here, but somehow my browser started to have issues and there was NO WAY I could get back onto bandamp to fix the bad result of this half-post.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>IT STILL TAKES WAAAYY TOOO LOOOONGG TO LOAD A SINGLE PAGE ON THIS FORUM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1111111111111                                                              *

Anyway I'll try again. I have a slight hangover so it's not going to be the longish post I wrote last night... I'll cut it down to the essence.


I WOULD LIKE TO SEE more control to one's uploaded work! It would be very cool to be able to set options for songs (and per song) on one's music page. Options could include:

Song is listed in [Audio Review/Work in Progress Pit/Archived(not listed)]
Song is Playable [yes/no] if tagged no, rating and commenting should be disabled aswell, and all the conditions of the latter option should be met and respected aswell.
Song is Downloadable [yes/no]
Song Thread accepts comments [yes/no] if tagged no, rating is disabled aswell, and song cannot be entered in a battle. Cannot be tagged no if song is already in a battle.

Tags can be changed at any point a member chooses to.

How about a Audio Review sub-forum listing only songs that are in a battle? I know the Current Battle page, but I'm talking specific forum layout for those songs. Right on top of the Audio Review forum could be a link to the Battle Review forum.

Anyway these were ideas that have been playing in my mind for quite a while, and this is certainly meeting TLS's idea from the start of this thread. I hope posting this post will cause no problems this time!






* yes I know what this looks like, and it looks like that on purpose :razz:

I agree with this as well...except for the option to have it played and  the option to not have comments. Why would you upload a track that can't be played and no one can leave a review for? Also the option to have it not listed as well doesn't make sense to me. Am I missing something here? One thing I would add would be that non-members CAN'T download anything.(regardless if the track has the option to do so) Yes it's easy to sign up but at least they would take the time to do so and might end up being a nice addition to the community.Be nice if this was all implemented.. ...mine worked! lol
#7March 22nd, 2008 · 02:37 PM
74 threads / 3 songs
529 posts
Cook Islands
I really like TLS' and PX'S ideas a lot.
But another thing that should be considered(I'm not quite positive if this has been said already or not) is a cover forum. 
And also,when you upload your music,you also get the chance to put in under the genre of rock,classic rock,techno,metal,instrumental,and what have you. That way when you browse for something you can get it more specified and it'll make life way easier. And then when it's in the Audio Review and you click on it and blah and you listen to it,you know what style it is.

But those are only ideas :]

PS. I was following the song delete thing and instead of deleting posts or whatever,maybe like a suspension for a day,week,month, etc?
#8March 22nd, 2008 · 03:47 PM
12 threads / 8 songs
70 posts
South Africa
POT (Possible off topic!) but one of the best things about the amp is that you end up hearing such a lot of different music. i can think of at least 10 artists who i would never of listened to if they had self-classified yet I've have heard and been inspired by some of the most original music I've heard in years. genre is an artificial device - I wouldn't know where to put myself - nor would most musicians. If someone called themselves pop I probably wouldn't listen but as it is I listen to every new post. Please do not add genre. With regard to the abusive member issue (i.e. delete in order to upload) as far as I can see it is few and far between. Issue would be best dealt with on a community basis - if it is clear someone is putting up songs but not commenting, just ignore the songs.

I agree with basketcase insofar as the only control a member should have over their music is whether their music can be downloaded or not. I can quite happily make music for myself forever but the whole point of posting it is for others to listen to.
#9March 22nd, 2008 · 04:03 PM
116 threads / 26 songs
1,361 posts
United States of America
well, to summarise and bring it back to the point of the thread, I'd say that BasketCase's view on nonmembers not having the right to download songs is still okay (since it's a separate option altogether).  As for genre, WaM has kind of hit that nail on the head... there used to be a genre search that you could do.  I suppose that it read the info out of your mp3 file's tag to discover each song's genre, though there were more "Unknown"s and "blank" entries than anything else.  I, for instance, put "Acoustic" into most of mine, but heaven knows I'm not a standard acoustic sound.  Genre is a toughy.  In theory it sounds like a good idea, but in practice, WaM has already said what there is to be said about it.

And for BasketCase's view on song upload options, I do have this to say:

We're going to have to bare in mind that simply because a certain group of users would never make use of a few options does not exactly mean that they should be scrap'd from the idea list.  Who on earth really alters Winamp 5's playlist "Advanced Title Formating" string to edit the way songs' info is displayed in the playlist?  Yet, the option remains in the program, for those who might want to do so.

How many people actually edit Windows' color scheme, except for those loonies you always see screenshots from, who have their old win98 window titlebars gradiented from deep red to green?  It's such a trivial thing, yet from time to time, someone wants to do it.  If we've got the power to give the option, then I say let's do it.  If 97% of all the users never utilise said options, then they won't really care all that much.  But the 3% who do will be grateful the options exist.

It's just a question of flexibility.  And since these options are really not that hard to implament, then it'll be cake to get them up and running once we've gotten the bigger issues with the site figured out.

That's all I've got to say on the matter for now :P

EDIT:  I think the direction PX is taking this idea thread is that we'd be turning BandAMP into something more than just a music community with a broken battle system   We'd be turning it into project space for people, for collabs, for covers, for people on the inner workings of a song that you're creating, who can listen in and help you allong, so that people like me don't litter up the audio review with 19 versions of my song so that I can get input on it while I am making it.
#10March 22nd, 2008 · 04:08 PM
12 threads / 8 songs
70 posts
South Africa
Besides - look at current rate of response. AS eg PX posted AtticBoy. Over two years 3000+ views and only 51 responses!! Who must be punished for this. Take away posting ability from everyone who viewed more than twice but did not post? Best response rate I've seen on entire site is +- 3% and half the comments were from the original poster! you can't force the issue. I would love more comments, I would love more praise. Maybe my music sucks, maybe my listeners are just lazy. One thing is to get rid of sensitivity. Sometimes some harsh criticism is neccessary, sometimes people only post to say "well done' (myself included). Sometimes you need just one person to say - "hey this is crap" for you to listen differently to your own music. Sometimes you just need one person to say "that was fuckin brilliant" to feel like you can do anything! Those who care about the purpose of this site will post, those who don't, won't.
#11March 22nd, 2008 · 07:01 PM
31 threads / 19 songs
612 posts
Canada
WaM wrote…
Besides - look at current rate of response. AS eg PX posted AtticBoy. Over two years 3000+ views and only 51 responses!! Who must be punished for this. Take away posting ability from everyone who viewed more than twice but did not post? Best response rate I've seen on entire site is +- 3% and half the comments were from the original poster! you can't force the issue. I would love more comments, I would love more praise. Maybe my music sucks, maybe my listeners are just lazy. One thing is to get rid of sensitivity. Sometimes some harsh criticism is neccessary, sometimes people only post to say "well done' (myself included). Sometimes you need just one person to say - "hey this is crap" for you to listen differently to your own music. Sometimes you just need one person to say "that was fuckin brilliant" to feel like you can do anything! Those who care about the purpose of this site will post, those who don't, won't.

problem is the system counts every time you go to your page as well...also I'm sure it counts non members as well which you know can't leave comments..I think when you respond to someone's comments it counts as a view afetr its posted as well...that's a big reason why the view to post count is so different.Anyways, back to the regularly scheduled programming.

TLS..the point you made about a minority using said options has no relevance to me as far as the options to be able to be played and have comments left. If you were to use that option on a track then why and the heck would you upload it at all ? A place to store your tracks maybe....that's actually what you would be doing.Well...like I said before, I think every other option is a great idea!
#12March 22nd, 2008 · 08:38 PM
110 threads / 55 songs
463 posts
Nepal
I think I suggested it on another thread but what about a "playlist of the month" instead of a battle I think this could be a good idea and would provide a good "snap shot" of whats good on the Amp each month just an simple "button" on the music review page would be enough and replace a competition system that is not working
just a thought
#13March 23rd, 2008 · 04:45 AM
115 threads / 52 songs
3,046 posts
Netherlands
in fact,
The option to have a song Not Playable is to have the reference and thread with comments still on the forum if an artist (for copyright reasons) cannot allow it being playable on here. We know that songs that have been in battles cannot be removed from the site, in this way a song can be disabled but the thread still accessible.

Mind that comments should then only be disabled if download aswell as playability are disabled (I think) though I must say it would be weird if a song was not playable but still downloadable. For some odd-sampling frequencies I can imagine the playback being ruined by bandamps own player, and an artist may decide you have to download the track to listen to it instead (rather re-upload at the right frequency but hey ho, not my problem).

Not listing songs (having them only archived on one's song page) seems like an idea if peeps want to share tracks for instance, using it as a transfer medium. Instead of uploading a bare guitar track via email one could use bandamp itself, mind to check the "not listed" option so the bare tracks do not end up in the Audio Review.

Also, having it not playable but downloadable in that case aswell so not just anyone who accesses the bare track can take a sneak peek. They have to download it instead...

That's some of the usages
#14March 23rd, 2008 · 04:47 AM
115 threads / 52 songs
3,046 posts
Netherlands
..and in addition, the "Songs" number should only count for Listed songs in the Audio Review. Not counting unlisted songs or archived ones. But lets not get too far ahead, we'll have to see what peeps think of this all and whether it's programmable or not.
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